pameladean: chalk-fronted corporal dragonfly (Libellula julia)
[personal profile] pameladean
I'm thinking of starting a Patreon. I know, all the cool kids have done so already, but I am still thinking about it. For good or ill, that is how I roll.

David has supported my writing career since 1981. I have in fact made money from writing, and it came in very handy for any number of things. But after Juniper, Gentian, and Rosemary was published in 1998, I didn't sell any more novels. I wrote a synopsis and the first few chapters of a Liavek novel and submitted it to Tor, which rejected it. Then Harry Potter became a sensation, and Sharyn November started the Firebird line at Viking/Penguin and bought up and reissued much of my backlist. She also bought a new novel called Going North. Briefly, I turned the book in late and too long. It was suggested that I expand it into two volumes, which I did; but at that point two-volume fantasy novels were not doing well, so I was asked, and perhaps unwisely agreed, to try and shrink the even-longer revision back down to 100,000 words. This did not go well at all.

Going North was cancelled in 2012, and then took a very long time to be pried loose from the publisher that no longer wanted it. In the meantime, I worked on the Liavek novel and on a number of pieces of short fiction, none of which is as yet finished. I don't work fast, but I have been working. Last year, Patricia Wrede and I put together a collection of our Liavek stories from the original anthologies, added a story Pat had written that never got into any of the anthologies, newly-revised; and also added a brand-new collaborative story about some of the background of our characters and their ancestral connection. This was published by Diversion Books as Points of Departure. Diversion Books did a lovely job on the cover and editing and the entire project was very gratifying. Unsurprisingly, however, it did not really solve our financial problems.

In the meantime, the market for the kind of work David does has been evolving; and we've been limping from crisis to crisis and having a hard time making ends meet. The house has accumulated a lot of deferred maintenance. Once I got the rights to Going North back, I approached various agents with it, but none of them wanted to represent it. I am also, honestly, a bit out of patience with conventional publishing.

In response to this lack of patience, David and I recently started Blaisdell Press and reissued Juniper, Gentian, and Rosemary and The Dubious Hills. We are also going to reissue "Owlswater," a Secret Country novella originally published in Jane Yolen's Xanadu series. But reissues aren't enough. We fully plan to publish the new novel. However, it needs to be revised and expanded again from the state I got it into trying to reduce it to the contractually mandated 100,0000 words; and I haven't been able to settle to this properly because I am so worried about money and the state of the house. Also, with timing I will not dignify by describing it, I was just diagnosed with type 2 diabetes. This is stressful, time-consuming, and, even with insurance, expensive.

I am having a very hard time working. If I could generate some income, it would be much easier for me to concentrate as I need to, and we might be able to begin fixing things that need fixing, as well as continuing to pay our share of the mortgage and our health insurance premiums, buy groceries, and so on.

I know that many people write far more than I do while they too are dealing with chronic illness, day jobs, and other very pressing problems. But I write as fast as I write. What I have is this: these are my stories. Nobody else can tell them.

David continues to look for work and to do it when he gets it. He'll be teaching a course this fall, but that doesn't pay as much as it ought to.

I haven't thought through the levels yet, but among the things I am considering offering are such diverse elements as:

Scenes from the short stories I'm working on. These include one about wish-granting merpeople and one about astronomical werewolves. The latter is a result of having removed entire characters wholesale from Going North. There are several others too inchoate for an easy description.

Chapters from the Liavek novel. This takes place after the events of the last Liavek collection, and is about the theater.

Videos of me reading snippets of the offered passages.

Videos of me answering questions that supporters of the Patreon send in.

Cat pictures, of course. Possibly cat videos, though this depends more than photos do on the actual cooperation of the cats.

Chapters of the original very long and extremely opaque Going North.

Chapters of the even longer and still somewhat opaque two-volume version of Going North.

Posts about the process of revising the latest version of Going North, which will be sometimes subtle, but not actually opaque.

If there's actual interest, vegan and veganizable recipes I have made, with commentary. (I eat a diet that is mostly vegan but does encompass fish and occasionally sheep- or goats-milk cheese, but I have recipes for cheese substitutes, and some fish recipes work nicely with tofu.)

I'd like to say garden photos and essays, but the yard is one of the things that needs fixing. Well, there's certainly a lot of it and it does have a lot of things growing in it, as well as birds and dragonflies and bees and so on. So, I suppose, if there was interest in an ex-garden, or a garden that needs to be rehabilitated, it would be fairly easy to write about what's out there.

I know that some of you don't like dealing with unfinished work, or waiting a long time for something you've had a taste of. I will do the best I can not to be more dilatory than necessary.

What do you guys think? Is there anything else you'd like to see, in addition or instead?

Thanks very much.

Pamela

Date: 2016-07-09 12:57 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] timprov.livejournal.com
I would suggest that if you started a Patreon and offered absolutely nothing, you would do nearly as well as if you did all of this extra work. Your market is people who already appreciate your work and want to help you have the time/space to do it in, and those people would probably rather you not be spending that on maintaining the Patreon. Where it works well, Patreon is not product-focused, but patronage-focused; people are more interested in supporting than in getting stuff.

If this bothers you, perhaps offer a percentage of their pledge back in Blaisdell Press credit. That way your patrons get your books for their patronage, which is the thing they cared about enough to be there in the first place.

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From: [identity profile] asakiyume.livejournal.com - Date: 2016-07-28 10:19 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2016-07-09 01:46 am (UTC)
redbird: closeup of me drinking tea, in a friend's kitchen (Default)
From: [personal profile] redbird
I follow a blogger whose reward for donations is that contributors get to see some of her posts a couple of weeks sooner than people who haven't donated. But she isn't creating extra material to use as a reward.

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Date: 2016-07-09 01:08 am (UTC)
jenett: (kosmos)
From: [personal profile] jenett
Seconding Timprov.

(I would, if you wanted to write a something, be amiable about a mix of cat pictures, outside things observed that intrigue you, and maybe things you've read or listened to or talked about with people that are interesting, but y'know, mostly at "I want more of your fiction, and am glad to support making it happen, the fiction is its own reward.")

Date: 2016-07-09 01:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rachelmanija.livejournal.com
I am, as always, happy to brainstorm and advise. Honestly I could use the distraction from my own problems. Can we talk about it over email, though?

(Short version is yes, a Patreon is a great idea but I'd also like to help you make more money by actually selling your books. No guarantees - I've done this with a number of people and the success level has varied - but overall my record is good and most people who have taken my suggestions have had it work out for them. I won't be making any suggestions about how or what to write, just about how to profit from whatever you write or have already written.)

Date: 2016-07-09 03:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] redmorlock.livejournal.com
I know nothing about how to use Patreon as a creator, but what Timprov says sounds extremely reasonable to me. Most people help artists to help them and not for what they get from helping.

Date: 2016-07-09 05:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kalmn.livejournal.com
I have no advice (or spare money atm) but when you do this thing I will tell people about it.

Date: 2016-07-09 11:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kakiphony.livejournal.com
No advice, but if you start it, I'm there regardless of what the rewards are or how frequent they are. I can't be a huge contributor, but I can absolutely chip in. Your work shaped my adolescence, and I would love to help make your life easier so new work can come into the world.

Date: 2016-07-09 11:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mizkit.livejournal.com
SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY

My personal experience with crowdfunding in general and Patreon in particular is that people are at the heart of it _most interested_ in supporting You, The Writer, and that the stories, pictures, whatever, is essentially bonus material to them no matter what it is. With Kickstarter since you're selling a particular project it's especially *nice* if it comes through, but an awful lot of people (including myself) tend to regard the eventual reward as like an unexpected, not necessarily anticipated, gift.

I love posts about the revision process from other writers, because it never works the same for anybody and I think that's fascinating. I'd be totally down for food blog stuff, because yay!

I'm pretty sure you could get mileage out of an Ex Garden topic. :)

An important thing is to try not to make too much *extra* work for yourself, so if you'd be inclined to do revision process posts anyway, y'know, that's a plus. But if you're really not emotionally inclined to do that, the truth is we're probably all pretty easy and if cat photos are on the menu, then that's what we'll have, and happily, if you'll just take our money. <3

Date: 2016-07-09 02:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ladymondegreen.livejournal.com
Yes, this. As your readers we want to see you stay solvent and happy. Occasional flash updates are nice, but they are a bonus, not a reason to buy in.

Date: 2016-07-09 12:38 pm (UTC)
evil_plotbunny: A bunny goes where a bunny must (Fountain)
From: [personal profile] evil_plotbunny
Another second or third or fourth for what timprov said. I think in this case if you build it, they will come.

Date: 2016-07-09 06:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sartorias.livejournal.com
I think it is awesome that you are doing this. (And more proof that I am not, and never will be, cool: no Patreon, and never will be.)

Date: 2016-07-10 12:00 am (UTC)
ext_12911: This is a picture of my great-grandmother and namesake, Margaret (officinalis)
From: [identity profile] gwyneira.livejournal.com
Definitely what Timprov said. I would gladly read extra bits if you wrote them, but I would even more gladly just contribute so that you had the time and space to write what you wanted/needed to write.

Date: 2016-07-10 06:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] alecaustin.livejournal.com
Not much to add other than that as many people have said, Tim is correct. Extra content would not be necessary to get my support.

me 2, 3, ... n

Date: 2016-07-10 08:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ambartil.livejournal.com
I would be happy to contribute what $ I can -- as witness my actually signing in to LJ for the 1st time in YEARS to say so. There are things I would really like to see, but I'll leave that for later, due to tedious hardware problems.

Martin

Date: 2016-07-11 12:37 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
Another person chiming in to say that when I toss money to Patreon, I'm not deciding on the basis of getting goodies.
I have my little pile that I can spare, and I am supporting writers I admire.
So do it, already, so I can sign on.

Date: 2016-07-11 02:37 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] amberley.livejournal.com
While you are thinking it over perhaps you could start a Patreon anyway? I don't care what sort of things you post as long as you enjoy them rather than being a source of stress. Cat pictures, untamed garden pictures, snippets, whatever pleases you to share or none at all. Just the knowledge a bit of my money could help Going North come to be would be a vast joy to me.

Also, if you start it soon we can spread the word at Worldcon.

Date: 2016-07-11 04:41 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I would give you money for Going North now and hope to get the book someday and not be angry if I never did. For that matter I would indeed simply give you money to help you write with nothing in return. Hope things get better for you soon. -a devoted reader

Date: 2016-07-11 04:51 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] timprov.livejournal.com
The other thing about Patreon is I think it's the one thing that's come around recently which has the potential to be a lot like LJ, if we can just get people posting regular free stuff there. It has a lovely chronological, all posts, friends-page-like feed, and the posts are unlimited length and include useful things like paragraphs.

Date: 2016-07-11 12:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] humming-along.livejournal.com
You have been one of my favorite authors since Tam Lin, and I for one would be happy to support you on Patreon. Even without extras, I would be glad to tangibly thank you for the joy you've brought me through your writing.

Date: 2016-07-12 03:10 am (UTC)
lcohen: (books)
From: [personal profile] lcohen
since other people have addressed patreon, i thought i would talk about going north. did you like the two book length of it? is there any reason not to just look at that version, ignore the shortened version, and just tighten that up? do you need the files because i think i have copies of them still on some computer. i will mention that *i* liked the two book length version.

i would probably have to patreon at a very low level, but i'd be happy to do that.

Date: 2016-07-16 07:34 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I want more books from you and I want you to have the time and the stress-free ability to write them. I would contribute to the best of my current situation and all I would hope for is the new book whenever it appears in the world.

Date: 2016-07-24 11:36 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] minnehaha.livejournal.com
Make it easy for your friends and followers to help you tell stories.

K.

Date: 2016-07-24 11:58 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] hairmonger.livejournal.com
What they said! Better than I can.

Date: 2016-07-25 05:08 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
We have been fans of your work since our early teens (30 years ago now) when we recognised some of our life experience in the Benedicti family and began considering our own responsibilities and relationships. Speaking for us all, I very truly hope you set up a Patreon, as a chance to support an author who through her work gave us hope during some very dark times would be both a delight and a privilege.

As a supporter I would be glad to read your shopping lists, frankly; some readers just feel like that about some authors. But we would not be supporting you for goodies, but to have the chance to give back when your work has given us so very much.

Date: 2016-07-28 10:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] asakiyume.livejournal.com
I'm late to this post, but I support this idea 100 percent. All the things you're thinking of offering sound good.

These are my stories. Nobody else can tell them.

Amen.

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